No more Bardens left!!!! Lets try and make em!

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7/16/2004 5:03 AM

Toby

No more Bardens left!!!! Lets try and make em! Hi everyone, I'm in the middle of building my dream telecaster guitar right now and had my mind set on some Joe Barden T-Style pickups. I'm located down here in New Zealand and for the last few weeks have been searching the world almost for a supply of these. Apparently Joe has gone out of business for now and you only need to take a look on ebay to see how the prices for his pickups are going through the roof.     Has anyone ever thought of trying to build a pickup along the same line as Joe's? I plan on doing exactly that and am even prepared to pull one apart to do it. I've got a bid on ebay for a broken one? so hopefully I'll end up with it.     Anyway, I've researched quite a bit about them and already coming from a output transformer winding background, can comprehend to a degree what he's trying to do.     From listening to Danny Gatton alot the pickups are very bright which would suggest they have quite low winding resistance, however not so low to loose the bottom end. On the other hand they are supposed to be terribly hot, with an output voltage very much higher than a typical pickup.     This tells me that the magnetic bar he uses is quite strong and the pole blades are made of a stainless steel with a good content of carbon so as to conduct the magnetic field efficiently.     Correct me if I'm wrong guys. What I want to know is, has anyone done some measurements on them and worked out winding resistance, inductance, output voltage, flux density etc etc??     It's a shame they are no longer available and I do hope he gets back in business however I would like to have a go at doing a set for myself to fit to my new tele.     Sorry for the long post but I'm really keen to do a little experimenting with these.     Cheers, Toby.

 

7/16/2004 5:53 AM

Dave Stephens

I don't think they are all that unique, a ceramic magnet, two coils, some steel blades, Bill Lawrence makes something similar, Bardens probably sound better because they are hand wound I think. Alot of it I think is just mystique, and personally I think a real hand wound tele bridge pickup or whatever sounds better. One of my amp building buddies has been lusting after Bardens for a long time and suddenly he scored a set about a month ago. Well, then he heard a bridge pickup I made for one of my jam buddies, so he sold the Bardens on Ebay and I made him a tele pickup, now he's happy and has a pocket full of loot. If I were you I'd just make myself a tele bridge pickup, they are much easier to make and you don't lose something from doing the hum cancelling trick. Making a Barden copy is going to be a pain in the butt probably and you're going to have to source a magnet that size and some thin wire and then have to deal with making bobbins for blades which is a pain in the butt. My opinion anyway.....Dave

 

7/16/2004 12:58 PM
Greg Simon	Just get a pickup from Dave and you'll be miles ahead of where you might be with Bardens. I've heard some of Dave's pickups and he can really wind a nice coil! Plus he's a nice guy to boot. IMHO of course.   Greg

 

7/16/2004 6:19 PM

Dave Stephens

Errrrr, ugggggh, I'm not trying to sell pickups on the forum here, please!!! My point is that Bardens have a mystique about them, and really they are just damn pickups. There are some people who actually HATE Bardens, OK? I don't care either way, Personally , most humbucking designs aren't my favorites. I spent the last couple weeks trying to come up with a humbucker I could live with and sell, and it was a struggle. But plug in a P90 and the humbucker is toast! The mystique deal is an awesome thing to have, Barden was lucky that he gained a reputation that verges on being religious for some people. Having Danny Gatton as a guinea pig didn't hurt either.         the really hard part of making a Barden "copy" is going to be getting the right size ceramic magnet, and even harder is going to be trying to make a bobbin for two skinny little coils with openings for those blades. Cutting a slot for a blade is a hassle, Bardens use some kind of phenolic or plastic bobbins, precision cut, matching that with a handmade product is going to be tough unless you own a machine shop.         My advice? Buy that broken Barden off Ebay and fix it and you're done.....Dave

 

7/16/2004 8:23 PM
Greg Simon	Sorry Dave. I won't do any more plugging on here for ya. But I think a lot of people should take a look at what you have to offer. You've got some of the mojo that I've heard from Jason's, Wolfe's, TV Jones, etc., so you're on the right track! Someday maybe I'll be able to wind stuff that sounds half as good...   Greg

 

7/17/2004 5:53 AM

Toby

Thanks for the info Dave.I realise there is a lot of hype around these pickups but I simply love that tone. I'm not put off by the fact that I'll have to fashion a bobbin somehow. I dont care how ugly it looks as long as it works like the Bardens. I don't plan on selling any so I don't need to worry about fancy packaging. Only experimentation.     I had a listen to some sound bites of your Texas Start pickups earlier today. Very nice. They sound like they have quite a high output which is what you're after if you want to overdrive the front end of a tube amp.     The thing I like about the Bardens is that they are crystal clear with a lot of balls if you know what I mean. I'm not sure how He gets such a high output from a two coils with specs I've seen around the net of around 4-5kohm resistance across the two coils and about 6H of inductance. The magnets must be particularly strong or He's wound them quitew tight to achieve good coupling around the pole pieces.     I've got some ceramic magnets on order and can get some stainless steel sheet suitable for magnetic conduction so I'll be doing a bit of experimenting shortly. From pictures I can work out the length and width of the magnets however the thickness is a mystery at the moment.I'll just have to try a few different sizes.     Toby

 

7/17/2004 9:57 AM
Sheldon Dingwall	Toby what grade of stainless are you thinking?     Regarding the lowish DCR, it could be that the coils are wired in parallel. IMO it's likely that they are wired in parallel since that would give the pickup a slightly more convincing single coil tone.

 

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