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Why I haven't gone into the boutique business

4/16/2003 3:25 PM
R.G.	Why I haven't gone into the boutique business I've been designing and building musical equipment all my adult life. I get asked a lot why I haven't started an effects business. It's really a matter of focus - to be successful at an effects business you need to do a lot of stuff that is not related to effects or the music industry at all. In fact, being successful at an effects business probably means you'll do almost NO work with the effects themselves. Consider what successful businesses do. They advertise - a lot. They manage ordering and inventory, hiring, firing, accounting, payroll, insurance, building ramps to comply with the ADA, dealing with OSHA complaints, dealing with disgruntled customers, dealing with insane customers, paying utility bills, getting loans, worrying about cash flow and paying taxes. Oh, yeah, lots of paying taxes. A hot new sounding effect circuit in a slickly designed, user friendly, durable case won't do it. Where are you going to get form-fitting shipping cartons and those little plastic wrappers to keep them nice? Where are you getting your instruction manuals printed? Where are you getting your shipping cartons printed? Do you have your order entry software or paper forms ready? Are you going to build a fair amount of inventory and wait to sell them, or build to order and hope you get them completed in time? The entire mess of running a small shop falls on your shoulders. If you don't have a captive market, or some kind of unique group of people who want your stuff, you're going to have to compete - hard. You'll have to beat the sidewalk to all kinds of stores to get them to stock your stuff and not the stuff from the last seventeen guys that came through with their bright ideas. You're going to have to go to trade shows. You're going to have to decide whether the internet is enough advertising or if you need to get that half page in Guitar Player. If you're going to build a few pedals and sell them from your web site, great! If you're at all competant about it, you'll make several thousand dollars a year at it. Don't let my opinions discourage you; keep a clear head about what you need to do to run a business, and if it's the right thing to do, JUMP! Until you've done some clear headed evaluation, as they say - don't quit your day job I've kept falling on the side of getting a better return on my time by working a day job, and playing at effects. I like messing with electronics. I don't like deciding whether my inventory is LIFO or FIFO. R.G.

4/16/2003 3:25 PM

R.G.

Why I haven't gone into the boutique business

I've been designing and building musical equipment all my adult life. I get asked a lot why I haven't started an effects business.

It's really a matter of focus - to be successful at an effects business you need to do a lot of stuff that is not related to effects or the music industry at all. In fact, being successful at an effects business probably means you'll do almost NO work with the effects themselves.

Consider what successful businesses do. They advertise - a lot. They manage ordering and inventory, hiring, firing, accounting, payroll, insurance, building ramps to comply with the ADA, dealing with OSHA complaints, dealing with disgruntled customers, dealing with *insane* customers, paying utility bills, getting loans, worrying about cash flow and paying taxes. Oh, yeah, lots of paying taxes.

A hot new sounding effect circuit in a slickly designed, user friendly, durable case won't do it.

Where are you going to get form-fitting shipping cartons and those little plastic wrappers to keep them nice? Where are you getting your instruction manuals printed? Where are you getting your *shipping cartons* printed? Do you have your order entry software or paper forms ready? Are you going to build a fair amount of inventory and wait to sell them, or build to order and hope you get them completed in time?

The entire mess of running a small shop falls on your shoulders. If you don't have a captive market, or some kind of unique group of people who want your stuff, you're going to have to compete - hard. You'll have to beat the sidewalk to all kinds of stores to get them to stock your stuff and not the stuff from the last seventeen guys that came through with *their* bright ideas. You're going to have to go to trade shows. You're going to have to decide whether the internet is enough advertising or if you need to get that half page in Guitar Player.

If you're going to build a few pedals and sell them from your web site, great! If you're at all competant about it, you'll make several thousand dollars a year at it.

Don't let my opinions discourage you; keep a clear head about what you need to do to run a business, and if it's the right thing to do, JUMP!

Until you've done some clear headed evaluation, as they say - don't quit your day job 8-)

4/16/2003 6:58 PM
Matt	I once saw a quote in a beer-brewing book made by a guy who started a micro-brewery. It goes something like: "I had the world's greatest hobby and I had to go and ruin it by making it my profession." Here's another quote but I don't know where it came from: "Don't do what you love, love what you do." Kinda makes sense for someone like me who often thinks that playing guitar or building amps is a dream job and my good paying, good benefits, low pressure job on a National Wildlife Reserve is so bad. Matt

4/16/2003 6:58 PM

Matt

I once saw a quote in a beer-brewing book made by a guy who started a micro-brewery. It goes something like: "I had the world's greatest hobby and I had to go and ruin it by making it my profession."

Here's another quote but I don't know where it came from: "Don't do what you love, love what you do." Kinda makes sense for someone like me who often thinks that playing guitar or building amps is a dream job and my good paying, good benefits, low pressure job on a National Wildlife Reserve is so bad.

Matt

4/18/2003 4:53 PM
Mark	RG - that's exactly how I was with recording.. I used to work a day job, and run a small project studio at night (as well as work as engineer at a few other places).. it got to an important crossroads where I had to decide whether to stick with my day job (technology) or my night job (recording).. while I love recording, I dont' like the BUSINESS end of it.. so now it's just my hobby again, and I'm happy. I can relate 100%. "-)

4/18/2003 4:53 PM

Mark

RG - that's exactly how I was with recording..
I used to work a day job, and run a small project studio at night (as well as work as engineer at a few other places)..
it got to an important crossroads where I had to decide whether to stick with my day job (technology) or my night job (recording).. while I love recording, I dont' like the BUSINESS end of it.. so now it's just my hobby again, and I'm happy.

I can relate 100%.
"-)

4/20/2003 8:38 AM
nic	large scale production, the right niche, and the value First I wanna say, Gosh it is great to read the wisdom of old school ampagers like Mr. RG Keen again! You go to any Guitar Center and they will tell you that they do not stock zvex (for example) based on the simple fact that the volume doesn't meet their buying power. This may be true, it could be partially true? If you break it down and think about it all big sellers want are cheapo shit, from the pink Strats that GC bought from Fender and resold cheap in the '70's to the Danelectro reissues of the late '90's. Strange yet desireable items like a Fender Blender will sit on their rack for months. Their guys don't know how to sell them, they aren't paid to know how to sell them. They are paid to sell things that sell themselves, Line6. On that note, with any business it is important to find the right niche. In my town the one store that know's their niche is Emerald City guitars. It is a boutique retailer, but many more famous people visit Jay before the GC simply because his selection is unique, AND he sells things. The only other place in town that has an interesting selection WILL NOT budge on prices and attempt to play the GC game and that is ironically called the "Trading Musician". I don't know which consumers they prey on in order to stay in business, but they have been sitting on the same inventory for the past 5 years I have lived here. Or so it seems. A person that I know who can contribute to this very topic is Mr. Vex himself. If you wanna distribute your product to stores, you gotta know the clientel of each store. Ultimately, not EVERY guitar player has internet access. Some of our friends have found fantastic niches online, Steve of Small Bear, Joe of NIN, and our friend from musictoyz.com. How likely is the cheapest store front for everyone? My website and business only gets hits when I ACTIVELY mention it and pursue the thing. I am sure Mr. Keen could do a nice business for himself if he did not have responsibilities like a family to provide for. He'd probably make as much as any pizza delivery guy, which would be fine for a bachelor... BTW, I paid my rent the one and only month I ACTIVELY pursued my website, just about one year ago today. I spent a lot of time on it and in the long run lost a long term girlfriend over it. What is it worth? Besides your investors and partners it is important to realize what time you have for business vs. your loved ones. Many of the entrepenuers of America have been young AND single from the freedom fry master Simplot to the OS baron Bill Gates. Good luck! I remain single to this day in pursuit of the "right niche". nic

4/20/2003 8:38 AM

nic

large scale production, the right niche, and the value

First I wanna say, Gosh it is great to read the wisdom of old school ampagers like Mr. RG Keen again!

You go to any Guitar Center and they will tell you that they do not stock zvex (for example) based on the simple fact that the volume doesn't meet their buying power. This may be true, it could be partially true?

If you break it down and think about it all big sellers want are cheapo shit, from the pink Strats that GC bought from Fender and resold cheap in the '70's to the Danelectro reissues of the late '90's. Strange yet desireable items like a Fender Blender will sit on their rack for months. Their guys don't know how to sell them, they aren't paid to know how to sell them. They are paid to sell things that sell themselves, Line6.

On that note, with any business it is important to find the right niche. In my town the one store that know's their niche is Emerald City guitars. It is a boutique retailer, but many more famous people visit Jay before the GC simply because his selection is unique, AND he sells things. The only other place in town that has an interesting selection WILL NOT budge on prices and attempt to play the GC game and that is ironically called the "Trading Musician". I don't know which consumers they prey on in order to stay in business, but they have been sitting on the same inventory for the past 5 years I have lived here. Or so it seems.

A person that I know who can contribute to this very topic is Mr. Vex himself. If you wanna distribute your product to stores, you gotta know the clientel of each store. Ultimately, not EVERY guitar player has internet access. Some of our friends have found fantastic niches online, Steve of Small Bear, Joe of NIN, and our friend from musictoyz.com. How likely is the cheapest store front for everyone? My website and business only gets hits when I ACTIVELY mention it and pursue the thing.

I am sure Mr. Keen could do a nice business for himself if he did not have responsibilities like a family to provide for. He'd probably make as much as any pizza delivery guy, which would be fine for a bachelor...

BTW, I paid my rent the one and only month I ACTIVELY pursued my website, just about one year ago today. I spent a lot of time on it and in the long run lost a long term girlfriend over it. What is it worth? Besides your investors and partners it is important to realize what time you have for business vs. your loved ones. Many of the entrepenuers of America have been young AND single from the freedom fry master Simplot to the OS baron Bill Gates. Good luck! I remain single to this day in pursuit of the "right niche".

nic

4/25/2003 8:43 AM
zachary vex	Re: Why I haven't gone into the boutique business hmm. this was very disturbing for me to read, so if my response upsets some of you, i won't be surprised. RG said: "It's really a matter of focus - to be successful at an effects business you need to do a lot of stuff that is not related to effects or the music industry at all. In fact, being successful at an effects business probably means you'll do almost NO work with the effects themselves." zvex says: huh? what? you mean i didn't design my effects? wtf is that paragraph supposed to mean? RG continued: "Consider what successful businesses do. They advertise - a lot. They manage ordering and inventory, hiring, firing, accounting, payroll, insurance, building ramps to comply with the ADA, dealing with OSHA complaints, dealing with disgruntled customers, dealing with insane customers, paying utility bills, getting loans, worrying about cash flow and paying taxes. Oh, yeah, lots of paying taxes." zvex responds: advertise? am i missing something here? i've NEVER advertised. ahh, yes i do a lot of ordering and inventory work. however, if i was a hobbiest, i would be doing a lot of ordering as well. hiring and firing? pshaw. i've never fired anyone, and there are a total of 4 people who work with me directly, all independent contractors who work at home. OSHA compaints? i am mystified by this. who doesn't pay utility bills and insurance? who doesn't get loans? WHO DOESN'T PAY TAXES? cash flow? who doesn't worry about cash flow? every single person i know, independent businessperson or not, worries about cash flow. what is so new about what you are describing? RG went on: "A hot new sounding effect circuit in a slickly designed, user friendly, durable case won't do it." zvex says: huh? since when is there something inherently unsuccessful in a "hot new sounding effect"? RG continued: "Where are you going to get form-fitting shipping cartons and those little plastic wrappers to keep them nice? Where are you getting your instruction manuals printed? Where are you getting your shipping cartons printed? Do you have your order entry software or paper forms ready? Are you going to build a fair amount of inventory and wait to sell them, or build to order and hope you get them completed in time?" zvex responds: form-fitting shipping cartons? you can get any sized box you want with the thousands of standard sizes offered by shipping products companies that instantly flood your mailbox the moment you start any kind of business that ships products. ULINE is one of these companies... they are everywhere, and they ship the boxes to you overnight or within a day or so from local warehouses that are packed to the rafters with inexpensive boxes. plastic wrappers? huh? instruction manuals? i print them on my computer printer. always have, and when i have time, i go to kinkos and print up a thousand or so. order entry software? i use quickbooks. it's easy. it prints my fedex forms. it bills people via email. it collects payments via visa or amex. IT IS EASY. this is not rocket science. to track inventory, i get on the phone once a week with my painter, and let him know what's up with inventory. he drills and paints the boxes, and calls the assembler to inform him of what's coming. the assembler gets the boards ready while the boxes are underway, and when the boxes arrive at the assembler's, he umm... assembles them. 8^) it's a continuous flow, and IT'S EASY. no matter what happens, i can catch up on inventory in a matter of 5 to 10 days. usually i run out of something for a day or two. no shit. things are so smooth, jason has convinced me that we can start a custom shop where people can create one-of-a-kind pedals online and order them, and get them within a couple of weeks. RG blathered on: "The entire mess of running a small shop falls on your shoulders. If you don't have a captive market, or some kind of unique group of people who want your stuff, you're going to have to compete - hard. You'll have to beat the sidewalk to all kinds of stores to get them to stock your stuff and not the stuff from the last seventeen guys that came through with their bright ideas. You're going to have to go to trade shows. You're going to have to decide whether the internet is enough advertising or if you need to get that half page in Guitar Player." zvex responds: no shit, sherlock. the responsibility is mine, all mine. woohoo! i don't know if i'd START a boutique effect business right at this moment (now that our country has been completely highjacked by some kind of oil/military-industrial-complex mafia... oops, i meant now that we have such dire economic conditions). look, RG, competing is what is all about. it's what it's always been about. competition IS THE WHOLE IDEA. come up with something REALLY FUN, and people will beat a path to your door. it's always been the case. don't even think about the other guys! it doesn't make any sense, unless they are violating your intellectual property rights. trade shows? they are a blast. during january's NAMM show i was surrounded by 60,000 people visiting the convention, and sometimes the booth was mobbed by a crowd 3 to 4 people deep and 20 wide. rock stars were everywhere. what's not to like? is the internet important to selling pedals? i'm not sure. i do know that there is one kind of advertising that always works... the stores. you get your pedals into stores, and they are advertised and they sell. is it hard to get stores to pick you up? yes. but not impossible... keep in mind if you do get into stores, your effects had better KICK ASS or the salespeople will NEVER take them out of the case to show them off. BUYING half a page in guitar player? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. here's a little story for you... i got a call from Art Thompson, a lovely man, who used to be the technical editor for Guitar Player, but advanced to Editor. he has called me a few times this year trying to get a nano head for review but i've avoided sending him one until i was absolutely sure that the product was real. after selling 250 of them i was pretty sure that it was a solid piece, so i relented and sent him one to review. during the course of the conversation he told me that i could send it via slow delivery because he didn't have time to look at anything for at least a week and a half... he was swamped. i shipped it three day fedex, and he got it in two days (they do that sometimes). out of curiousity he opened it and was stuck playing through it all day. he called me around 2pm my time (4 pm california time) and asked me if i could sell it to him. get this through your head... if you want to make something that matters, you have to BREAK ALL THE RULES AND MAKE SOMETHING THAT MAKES EVERYONE WHO TOUCHES IT COVET IT. this is your responsibility. you might want to jump on an italjet scooter or hop in a bmw z-3 and open it up around the lakes for a few minutes while thinking about this concept if you want to get into the music equipment business. you have to COMPLETELY BLOW PEOPLE AWAY with your product, or else you will be stuck doing very mundane crap for the rest of your career. a fine vehicle is a very good model for a great piece of electronic musical gear... it should make your blood race through your veins. it should make you think about it day and night. RG went on: "If you're going to build a few pedals and sell them from your web site, great! If you're at all competant about it, you'll make several thousand dollars a year at it. " that's probably true for a start-up company. i was scraping by with sales of less than $2000 per month when i started in 1995, and it was all word-of-mouth. personally, i think the internet offers staggering possibilities for sales. i've never taken advantage of it because it requires very careful balance not to compete with my own storefront dealers who are my life's blood, but i think i've figured out how to handle the difficulty. RG finished up: "Don't let my opinions discourage you; keep a clear head about what you need to do to run a business, and if it's the right thing to do, JUMP! Until you've done some clear headed evaluation, as they say - don't quit your day job I've kept falling on the side of getting a better return on my time by working a day job, and playing at effects. I like messing with electronics. I don't like deciding whether my inventory is LIFO or FIFO." zvex retorted: jump? fuck, RG, it's not some kind of dynamic lunge. you just make something really interesting, first, and then see if someone wants to buy it. you do it slowly. it took me 8 years to get here, and i am only now considering whether i should advertise. when i started making pedals, my day job was being a recording engineer. that job drove me insane... trapped in a studio with people for 18 to 20 hours at a time, day after day, trying to make THEIR dreams come true. talk about distressing... making guitar effects has been a real relief. income... income... RG, why don't you email me with your total taxable income for last year? i'd love to see just what exact dollar amount has kept you from becoming my greatest competetor. i have a theory about the real reason, but i'd love to be proved wrong. zvex@zvex.com LIFO or FIFO? cripes, RG, i just stick the boxes in their own drawers (they are wire-basket drawers for easy inventory control), and i take them out of the drawers to box them up and ship them to dealers. last-in-first-out? first-in-first-out? what do you think a guitar effect is? STEAK? CHICKEN? i am not a butcher. i make things that last for awhile... the stock does NOT have to be "rotated." sheesh. THEY DON'T HAVE EXPIRATION DATES. RG, you endlessly disappoint me. you are a pedal-guru, an effects-guru, and you know much more about electronics than i do, and you have amazing retention and great insight into a lot of aspects of business and electronics. but you never seem to be able to reconcile your desire to be known for your ability to design effects and your inability to get out of the armchair. you've become the perfect example of "those who don't do, teach." and i meant to change the phrase... i know you can do it, RG. 8^)

4/25/2003 8:43 AM

zachary vex

Re: Why I haven't gone into the boutique business

hmm. this was very disturbing for me to read, so if my response upsets some of you, i won't be surprised.

RG said:

"It's really a matter of focus - to be successful at an effects business you need to do a lot of stuff that is not related to effects or the music industry at all. In fact, being successful at an effects business probably means you'll do almost NO work with the effects themselves."

zvex says:

huh? what? you mean i didn't design my effects? wtf is that paragraph supposed to mean?

RG continued:

"Consider what successful businesses do. They advertise - a lot. They manage ordering and inventory, hiring, firing, accounting, payroll, insurance, building ramps to comply with the ADA, dealing with OSHA complaints, dealing with disgruntled customers, dealing with *insane* customers, paying utility bills, getting loans, worrying about cash flow and paying taxes. Oh, yeah, lots of paying taxes."

zvex responds:

advertise? am i missing something here? i've NEVER advertised. ahh, yes i do a lot of ordering and inventory work. however, if i was a hobbiest, i would be doing a lot of ordering as well. hiring and firing? pshaw. i've never fired anyone, and there are a total of 4 people who work with me directly, all independent contractors who work at home. OSHA compaints? i am mystified by this. who doesn't pay utility bills and insurance? who doesn't get loans? WHO DOESN'T PAY TAXES? cash flow? who doesn't worry about cash flow? every single person i know, independent businessperson or not, worries about cash flow. what is so new about what you are describing?

RG went on:

"A hot new sounding effect circuit in a slickly designed, user friendly, durable case won't do it."

zvex says:

huh? since when is there something inherently unsuccessful in a "hot new sounding effect"?

RG continued:

"Where are you going to get form-fitting shipping cartons and those little plastic wrappers to keep them nice? Where are you getting your instruction manuals printed? Where are you getting your *shipping cartons* printed? Do you have your order entry software or paper forms ready? Are you going to build a fair amount of inventory and wait to sell them, or build to order and hope you get them completed in time?"

zvex responds:

form-fitting shipping cartons? you can get any sized box you want with the thousands of standard sizes offered by shipping products companies that instantly flood your mailbox the moment you start any kind of business that ships products. ULINE is one of these companies... they are everywhere, and they ship the boxes to you overnight or within a day or so from local warehouses that are packed to the rafters with inexpensive boxes. plastic wrappers? huh? instruction manuals? i print them on my computer printer. always have, and when i have time, i go to kinkos and print up a thousand or so. order entry software? i use quickbooks. it's easy. it prints my fedex forms. it bills people via email. it collects payments via visa or amex. IT IS EASY. this is not rocket science. to track inventory, i get on the phone once a week with my painter, and let him know what's up with inventory. he drills and paints the boxes, and calls the assembler to inform him of what's coming. the assembler gets the boards ready while the boxes are underway, and when the boxes arrive at the assembler's, he umm... assembles them. 8^) it's a continuous flow, and IT'S EASY. no matter what happens, i can catch up on inventory in a matter of 5 to 10 days. usually i run out of something for a day or two. no shit. things are so smooth, jason has convinced me that we can start a custom shop where people can create one-of-a-kind pedals online and order them, and get them within a couple of weeks.

RG blathered on:

"The entire mess of running a small shop falls on your shoulders. If you don't have a captive market, or some kind of unique group of people who want your stuff, you're going to have to compete - hard. You'll have to beat the sidewalk to all kinds of stores to get them to stock your stuff and not the stuff from the last seventeen guys that came through with *their* bright ideas. You're going to have to go to trade shows. You're going to have to decide whether the internet is enough advertising or if you need to get that half page in Guitar Player."

zvex responds:

no shit, sherlock. the responsibility is mine, all mine. woohoo! i don't know if i'd START a boutique effect business right at this moment (now that our country has been completely highjacked by some kind of oil/military-industrial-complex mafia... oops, i meant now that we have such dire economic conditions). look, RG, competing is what is all about. it's what it's always been about. competition IS THE WHOLE IDEA. come up with something REALLY FUN, and people will beat a path to your door. it's always been the case. don't even think about the other guys! it doesn't make any sense, unless they are violating your intellectual property rights. trade shows? they are a blast. during january's NAMM show i was surrounded by 60,000 people visiting the convention, and sometimes the booth was mobbed by a crowd 3 to 4 people deep and 20 wide. rock stars were everywhere. what's not to like? is the internet important to selling pedals? i'm not sure. i do know that there is one kind of advertising that always works... the stores. you get your pedals into stores, and they are advertised and they sell. is it hard to get stores to pick you up? yes. but not impossible... keep in mind if you do get into stores, your effects had better KICK ASS or the salespeople will NEVER take them out of the case to show them off.

BUYING half a page in guitar player? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. here's a little story for you... i got a call from Art Thompson, a lovely man, who used to be the technical editor for Guitar Player, but advanced to Editor. he has called me a few times this year trying to get a nano head for review but i've avoided sending him one until i was absolutely sure that the product was real. after selling 250 of them i was pretty sure that it was a solid piece, so i relented and sent him one to review. during the course of the conversation he told me that i could send it via slow delivery because he didn't have time to look at anything for at least a week and a half... he was swamped. i shipped it three day fedex, and he got it in two days (they do that sometimes). out of curiousity he opened it and was stuck playing through it all day. he called me around 2pm my time (4 pm california time) and asked me if i could sell it to him. get this through your head... if you want to make something that matters, you have to BREAK ALL THE RULES AND MAKE SOMETHING THAT MAKES EVERYONE WHO TOUCHES IT COVET IT. this is your responsibility. you might want to jump on an italjet scooter or hop in a bmw z-3 and open it up around the lakes for a few minutes while thinking about this concept if you want to get into the music equipment business. you have to COMPLETELY BLOW PEOPLE AWAY with your product, or else you will be stuck doing very mundane crap for the rest of your career. a fine vehicle is a very good model for a great piece of electronic musical gear... it should make your blood race through your veins. it should make you think about it day and night.

RG went on:

"If you're going to build a few pedals and sell them from your web site, great! If you're at all competant about it, you'll make several thousand dollars a year at it. "

that's probably true for a start-up company. i was scraping by with sales of less than $2000 per month when i started in 1995, and it was all word-of-mouth. personally, i think the internet offers staggering possibilities for sales. i've never taken advantage of it because it requires very careful balance not to compete with my own storefront dealers who are my life's blood, but i think i've figured out how to handle the difficulty.

RG finished up:

"Don't let my opinions discourage you; keep a clear head about what you need to do to run a business, and if it's the right thing to do, JUMP!

Until you've done some clear headed evaluation, as they say - don't quit your day job 8-)

I've kept falling on the side of getting a better return on my time by working a day job, and playing at effects. I like messing with electronics. I don't like deciding whether my inventory is LIFO or FIFO."

zvex retorted:

jump? fuck, RG, it's not some kind of dynamic lunge. you just make something really interesting, first, and then see if someone wants to buy it. you do it slowly. it took me 8 years to get here, and i am only now considering whether i should advertise. when i started making pedals, my day job was being a recording engineer. that job drove me insane... trapped in a studio with people for 18 to 20 hours at a time, day after day, trying to make THEIR dreams come true. talk about distressing... making guitar effects has been a real relief.

income... income... RG, why don't you email me with your total taxable income for last year? i'd love to see just what exact dollar amount has kept you from becoming my greatest competetor. i have a theory about the real reason, but i'd love to be proved wrong. zvex@zvex.com

LIFO or FIFO? cripes, RG, i just stick the boxes in their own drawers (they are wire-basket drawers for easy inventory control), and i take them out of the drawers to box them up and ship them to dealers. last-in-first-out? first-in-first-out? what do you think a guitar effect is? STEAK? CHICKEN? i am not a butcher. i make things that last for awhile... the stock does NOT have to be "rotated." sheesh. THEY DON'T HAVE EXPIRATION DATES.

RG, you endlessly disappoint me. you are a pedal-guru, an effects-guru, and you know much more about electronics than i do, and you have amazing retention and great insight into a lot of aspects of business and electronics. but you never seem to be able to reconcile your desire to be known for your ability to design effects and your inability to get out of the armchair. you've become the perfect example of "those who don't do, teach." and i meant to change the phrase... i know you can do it, RG. 8^)

4/25/2003 4:36 PM
Mark Hammer	So, uh, you found it kind of a ho-hum posting, eh? I think the basic point of RG's posting is sober second thought, a deterrent if you will. Sub-points include: 1) it's not all glitz, glamour, and mo money, mo money, mo money; 2) there is an enormous amount of sheer hard work and critical details because it IS a business, not just a revenue-generating hobby; 3) simply having an interesting product guarantees nothing in the absence of all the hard work and drudgery and business stuff. I didn't see anything from you that refuted that simple reality. Your point is well taken that it is important to have a product that stands out in the market and is "covet-able". At the same time, in all fairness, there are a great many folks who probably think their product is covet-able, but in the grand scheme of things it doesn't deliver value for price-point, or is really only covet-able by less of a market than they truly need to survive. In other words, unless you do soem serious market research, it is quite possible to get screwed by one's own enthusiasm for the product, as brilliant and cool as it might be. I mean, let's be honest here. If you took the Creamy Dreamer approach and had one single product to market, and let's say it was the Seek-Wah. Great product, covet-able, distinctive in the market, but how long could you have stayed afloat, given the rather narrow market that appeals to? (and I'm assuming here that country cover bands are not lining up to buy one). Based on what you know now, would you recommend anyone to start a commercial operation with a first product like that? Fortunately, in your own case, your product line isn't like a 1965 Mersey-beat album with one hit and eleven banal 2:37 cover tunes. Not everyone can do that, and it is only fair to warn them. As to the "big leap", I think that's going to depend on what it is you stand to lose or forfeit. Steve Daniels and I have discussed this many times. For those of us with a little grey (or more than a little) on our heads, forfeiting health coverage and a steady paycheck at a time in your life when there is a mortgage to cover and health-related expenses to attend to or anticipate puts a very different spin on things. That's not to say that others are unrealistic in their sense of what is a justifiable business venture. Rather, when there are things you absolutely need to have in place because of your own particular stage in life, your sense of what is acceptable risk is bound to be different. In your own case, unless you have a deal with the devil and are much older than the pictures make you out to be, you began your own venture at an earlier stage in life. I don't doubt that there were some crappy living arrangements during the initial phase of zvex. The fact of the matter is that you didn't have to concern yourself (unless there is another side to you that I didn't know about) with where your spouse and kids were going to live and whether there was a school nearby, and that makes a different on what is an acceptable risk and a fair return on fun for risk entertained. All RG was trying to say was that it is tricky enough that for lots of folks the fun you get out of it is unlikely to offset the pain and uncertainty that comes along with it. That won't be true for everybody, but it will be true often enough that it needs to be out in the open. I haven't seen a bull-in-a-china-shop posting from you in ages. My spider-senses tell me there is either a hot new product on the ZVEX protoboard or another source of sleeplessness like a trade-show coming up.

4/25/2003 4:36 PM

Mark Hammer

So, uh, you found it kind of a ho-hum posting, eh?

I think the basic point of RG's posting is sober second thought, a deterrent if you will. Sub-points include:
1) it's not all glitz, glamour, and mo money, mo money, mo money;
2) there is an enormous amount of sheer hard work and critical details because it IS a business, not just a revenue-generating hobby;
3) simply having an interesting product guarantees nothing in the absence of all the hard work and drudgery and business stuff.

I didn't see anything from you that refuted that simple reality. Your point is well taken that it is important to have a product that stands out in the market and is "covet-able". At the same time, in all fairness, there are a great many folks who probably *think* their product is covet-able, but in the grand scheme of things it doesn't deliver value for price-point, or is really only covet-able by less of a market than they truly need to survive. In other words, unless you do soem serious market research, it is quite possible to get screwed by one's own enthusiasm for the product, as brilliant and cool as it might be. I mean, let's be honest here. If you took the Creamy Dreamer approach and had one single product to market, and let's say it was the Seek-Wah. Great product, covet-able, distinctive in the market, but how long could you have stayed afloat, given the rather narrow market that appeals to? (and I'm assuming here that country cover bands are not lining up to buy one). Based on what you know now, would you recommend anyone to start a commercial operation with a first product like that? Fortunately, in your own case, your product line isn't like a 1965 Mersey-beat album with one hit and eleven banal 2:37 cover tunes. Not everyone can do that, and it is only fair to warn them.

As to the "big leap", I think that's going to depend on what it is you stand to lose or forfeit. Steve Daniels and I have discussed this many times. For those of us with a little grey (or more than a little) on our heads, forfeiting health coverage and a steady paycheck at a time in your life when there is a mortgage to cover and health-related expenses to attend to or anticipate puts a very different spin on things. That's not to say that others are unrealistic in their sense of what is a justifiable business venture. Rather, when there are things you absolutely need to have in place because of your own particular stage in life, your sense of what is acceptable risk is bound to be different. In your own case, unless you have a deal with the devil and are much older than the pictures make you out to be, you began your own venture at an earlier stage in life. I don't doubt that there were some crappy living arrangements during the initial phase of zvex. The fact of the matter is that you didn't have to concern yourself (unless there is another side to you that I didn't know about) with where your spouse and kids were going to live and whether there was a school nearby, and that makes a different on what is an acceptable risk and a fair return on fun for risk entertained.

All RG was trying to say was that it is tricky enough that for lots of folks the fun you get out of it is unlikely to offset the pain and uncertainty that comes along with it. That won't be true for everybody, but it will be true often enough that it needs to be out in the open.

I haven't seen a bull-in-a-china-shop posting from you in ages. My spider-senses tell me there is either a hot new product on the ZVEX protoboard or another source of sleeplessness like a trade-show coming up.

4/25/2003 8:31 PM
zachary vex	neither, mark. look at the title of his post. that is why i had such a strong reaction. he's just making excuses for himself... it's extremely annoying to watch an able-bodied man explain in detail why he will not walk, and in the process, justify everyone else remaining horizontal as well. i can see warning people about diving in too deep at the start. but the rest of it is simply fear-mongering.

4/25/2003 8:31 PM

zachary vex

neither, mark. look at the title of his post. that is why i had such a strong reaction. he's just making excuses for himself... it's extremely annoying to watch an able-bodied man explain in detail why he will not walk, and in the process, justify everyone else remaining horizontal as well.

i can see warning people about diving in too deep at the start. but the rest of it is simply fear-mongering.

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