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Vintage threads from the first ten years

What is that strat sound?

4/28/2003 4:46 AM
Ryan	What is that strat sound? What is the wiring configuration when a standard strat switch is positioned where the bridge and middle pickups are both on (2nd position?). Is that the "out of phase" sound/config? Can I wire a les paul humbucker in the configuration mentioned? Will that wiring configuration give a little bit of that strat bridge/middle sound? Thanks, Ryan

4/28/2003 5:00 AM
Steve A.	Ryan: The notched positions on strats are not out-of-phase and I believe that the distinctive "quack" is from having the two pickups sense the strings in two relatively narrow windows not that far apart. The bridge and neck pickups together give you a much different sound, not unlike the middle position on a tele, and that is basically what you get if you split the coils on a LP and blend the two pickups together. AFAIK you really can't get the "quack" sound of the strat notched positions on a LP. However, some humbuckers do sound okay when split so you can get a sound similar to the neck or bridge pickup on a strat. Steve Ahola

4/28/2003 5:00 AM

Steve A.

Ryan:

    The notched positions on strats are not out-of-phase and I believe that the distinctive "quack" is from having the two pickups sense the strings in two relatively narrow windows not that far apart. The bridge and neck pickups together give you a much different sound, not unlike the middle position on a tele, and that is basically what you get if you split the coils on a LP and blend the two pickups together.

    AFAIK you really can't get the "quack" sound of the strat notched positions on a LP.

    However, some humbuckers do sound okay when split so you can get a sound similar to the neck or bridge pickup on a strat.

Steve Ahola

4/29/2003 5:45 AM
Tim Escobedo	That sound is technically not out of phase (assuming it's stock), but it's nonetheless the very distinctive strat sound. My observation is that the sound comes from the pickups being physically closer together than on a typical two pickup guitar, but not so close that they would act like a parallel wired humbucker. It may be possible to get a slightly more strat-like "in between" sound from a LP if the pickups allow for each coil to be wired separately and the two inner coils of each pickup are wired in parallel. This way, each pickup senses a narrower area than the full humbucker, and presuming similarly wound pickups, will still be hum cancelling. I'll let you figure out how this would actually be wired. I've been wanting to experiment with this for a while, but unfortunately I lack a LP style guitar. If you mean getting that sound with a single humbucker, it really can't be done. You can wire the two coils of a humbucker in parallel, but the coils are so close together, it won't sound the same as two strat pickups. Another possibility is that you could reverse the wires of one of the coils, to give you a true out-of-phase sound. However, this will result in a humbucker that's no longer bucking hum. And it'll likely have a pretty dramatic volume drop as many of the string vibrations will be cancelled out.

4/29/2003 5:45 AM

Tim Escobedo

That sound is technically not out of phase (assuming it's stock), but it's nonetheless the very distinctive strat sound. My observation is that the sound comes from the pickups being physically closer together than on a typical two pickup guitar, but not so close that they would act like a parallel wired humbucker.

It may be possible to get a slightly more strat-like "in between" sound from a LP if the pickups allow for each coil to be wired separately and the two inner coils of each pickup are wired in parallel. This way, each pickup senses a narrower area than the full humbucker, and presuming similarly wound pickups, will still be hum cancelling. I'll let you figure out how this would actually be wired. I've been wanting to experiment with this for a while, but unfortunately I lack a LP style guitar.

If you mean getting that sound with a single humbucker, it really can't be done. You can wire the two coils of a humbucker in parallel, but the coils are so close together, it won't sound the same as two strat pickups. Another possibility is that you could reverse the wires of one of the coils, to give you a true out-of-phase sound. However, this will result in a humbucker that's no longer bucking hum. And it'll likely have a pretty dramatic volume drop as many of the string vibrations will be cancelled out.

4/29/2003 7:59 PM
Steve A.	Tim: It may be possible to get a slightly more strat-like "in between" sound from a LP if the pickups allow for each coil to be wired separately and the two inner coils of each pickup are wired in parallel. Well, the PRS rotary switch models offers such a linkage (inner coils in parallel) and it doesn't have that quack. I've tried it with a coil cut switch on one of my LP's and it doesn't quack either. If you want the quack, you gotta get the duck, er, strat... Steve Ahola

4/29/2003 7:59 PM

Steve A.

Tim:

It may be possible to get a slightly more strat-like "in between" sound from a LP if the pickups allow for each coil to be wired separately and the two inner coils of each pickup are wired in parallel.

Well, the PRS rotary switch models offers such a linkage (inner coils in parallel) and it doesn't have that quack. I've tried it with a coil cut switch on one of my LP's and it doesn't quack either.

If you want the quack, you gotta get the duck, er, strat...

Steve Ahola

4/29/2003 9:39 PM
Ryan	Would a 3- P90 Les paul sound like a strat? The les paul is a set neck counterfit with a gibson lespaul decal. It has minihumbucker/p90 routing. I doubt it's worth much. I have always dreamed of having three p90's with a 5 position selector setup in this guitar. I want the strat sounds but I prefer the les paul roominess at the bridge. The placement of the volume knob and the closeness of the strings to the body are a strat deal breaker. I think I'll have a hole routed in the middle position and go 3-p90's, 5 position rotary selector. If I do this will I get that strat b/m quack (approximately)? Would it be hard to rout a hole in a guitar with an unknown (standard looking black)finish without cracking the finish (any tips on how to do this)? Any source on 5 way rotary switches that fit a vol pot hole? Thanks, Ryan

4/29/2003 9:39 PM

Ryan

Would a 3- P90 Les paul sound like a strat?

The les paul is a set neck counterfit with a gibson lespaul decal. It has minihumbucker/p90 routing. I doubt it's worth much. I have always dreamed of having three p90's with a 5 position selector setup in this guitar. I want the strat sounds but I prefer the les paul roominess at the bridge. The placement of the volume knob and the closeness of the strings to the body are a strat deal breaker. I think I'll have a hole routed in the middle position and go 3-p90's, 5 position rotary selector. If I do this will I get that strat b/m quack (approximately)? Would it be hard to rout a hole in a guitar with an unknown (standard looking black)finish without cracking the finish (any tips on how to do this)? Any source on 5 way rotary switches that fit a vol pot hole?

Thanks,
Ryan

4/29/2003 11:24 PM
Steve A.	If you really want the quack... ... get a DuckBucker from Seymour Duncan. These are the strangest pickups I have ever tried because: #1. They sound quacky by themselves. #2. They sound quacky combined with other pickups (even mini-humbuckers). #3. And if you combine two of them they supposedly sound even quackier (I have just one so I couldn't test that out). For a P-90 sound from a strat pickup, try the Steel Poles from Lindy Fralin. I tried a strat with the SP in the bridge position... IIRC there was some quackiness in the B/M position but I'm not sure if you would get that if you had 3 SP's. BTW other companies are making them now (like SK over at the Pickup Builders forum). Steve Ahola

4/29/2003 11:24 PM

Steve A.

If you really want the quack...

... get a DuckBucker from Seymour Duncan. These are the strangest pickups I have ever tried because:
#1. They sound quacky by themselves.
#2. They sound quacky combined with other pickups (even mini-humbuckers).
#3. And if you combine two of them they supposedly sound even quackier (I have just one so I couldn't test that out).

For a P-90 sound from a strat pickup, try the Steel Poles from Lindy Fralin. I tried a strat with the SP in the bridge position... IIRC there was some quackiness in the B/M position but I'm not sure if you would get that if you had 3 SP's. BTW other companies are making them now (like SK over at the Pickup Builders forum).

Steve Ahola

4/30/2003 3:41 PM
Ryan	Do you know what the Duck bucker size configuration is. If it's not available in a p90 size, I wouldn't be able to install it in this lespaul copy. It has p90 holes only (I don't want to change the hole sizes, but i would add a 3rd middle position p90). So, If I had 3 p90 (sized) pickups in a lespaul, would it get some strat B/M quack? I was thinking of having a mini-humbucker in the bridge and a p90 in the middle (I have 2 original MH's, 2 Semore Duncans MH's, 1 p90 and a Bill laurence MH). One switch position would run 1 coil of the bridge with the p90 in the middle to attempt the strat quack. Or any sugestion to get the quack with 2 or 3 minihumbucker/p90 size pickups in a fake les paul? -Ryan

4/30/2003 3:41 PM

Ryan

Do you know what the Duck bucker size configuration is. If it's not available in a p90 size, I wouldn't be able to install it in this lespaul copy. It has p90 holes only (I don't want to change the hole sizes, but i would add a 3rd middle position p90).

So, If I had 3 p90 (sized) pickups in a lespaul, would it get some strat B/M quack?

I was thinking of having a mini-humbucker in the bridge and a p90 in the middle (I have 2 original MH's, 2 Semore Duncans MH's, 1 p90 and a Bill laurence MH). One switch position would run 1 coil of the bridge with the p90 in the middle to attempt the strat quack.

Or any sugestion to get the quack with 2 or 3 minihumbucker/p90 size pickups in a fake les paul?

-Ryan

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