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Graphtec saddles and a properly cut nut,...(m)

10/17/1999 9:36 PM
Wyatt	Graphtec saddles and a properly cut nut,...(m) The biggest problem with Bigsby's going out of tune is string binding. The string gets caught in a nut slot or hangs on one of those super pointy modern tune-a-matic saddles. Graphtec saddles help a lot on the bridge end. Nice and slick so the string passes back and forth with no problem. A good, properly cut nut is also ideal. One where the groove is no deeper than 1/2 the string width. The string should rest on a nut, not go through deep grooves (which have a habit of binding). The Bigsby doesn't give the strings enough slack to fall out of their groove, so don't think you'll need a locking nut or anything. In my experience, Sperzels and other locking tuners have been no better than Schallers and Grovers about keeping in tune. They do make restringing easier though. -Y.

10/17/1999 9:36 PM

Wyatt

Graphtec saddles and a properly cut nut,...(m)

The biggest problem with Bigsby's going out of tune is string binding. The string gets caught in a nut slot or hangs on one of those super pointy modern tune-a-matic saddles.

Graphtec saddles help a lot on the bridge end. Nice and slick so the string passes back and forth with no problem.

A good, properly cut nut is also ideal. One where the groove is no deeper than 1/2 the string width. The string should rest on a nut, not go through deep grooves (which have a habit of binding). The Bigsby doesn't give the strings enough slack to fall out of their groove, so don't think you'll need a locking nut or anything.

In my experience, Sperzels and other locking tuners have been no better than Schallers and Grovers about keeping in tune. They do make restringing easier though.

-Y.

10/17/1999 9:42 PM
Wyatt	Duh! This is a reply to Mark's Bigsby question My bad, posted instead of replyed.

10/20/1999 3:54 PM
Mark Hammer	Re: Graphtec saddles and a properly cut nut,...(m) Thanks for the tips. The nut groove depth is one that I hadn't considered. One generally thinks in terms of appropriate string height, so if the string is too high, you just make the groove deeper, right? Wrong. Presumably, the fewer parts of its perimeter are in contact with the nut, the less the string grabs when moving forward and backward as one wiggles the stick.

10/20/1999 3:54 PM

Mark Hammer

Re: Graphtec saddles and a properly cut nut,...(m)

Thanks for the tips.

The nut groove depth is one that I hadn't considered. One generally thinks in terms of appropriate string height, so if the string is too high, you just make the groove deeper, right? Wrong. Presumably, the fewer parts of its perimeter are in contact with the nut, the less the string grabs when moving forward and backward as one wiggles the stick.

10/20/1999 4:48 PM
Doc	After you cut the nut slots to the final depth for your preferred string height, you can lift the nut out and sand down the top surface to effectively remove the excess "wall" height across the nut. Use progressively finer grits to finish & polish the nut, then reinstall it permanently. Some folks add a trace of wax or vaseline+graphite powder paste to the string slot to break the "sticktion", which also helps reduce the sawing effect of wound strings. Old Fender guitars had wide vee cut nut slots, so the string only rested on the bottom of the groove. It seems they used a universal nut file, not like the guaged widths sold today. You can fashion this wide groove with a normal triangular file, to separate the tight parallel walls away from the string, after you've cut the groove depths with guaged nut slot files. Roll the top edge over to chamfer the vee out onto the top surface, then finish all edges smooth. I know GraphTech saddles do the job at the bridge, but for some reason I don't care for black bits on my nickel bridge. Someone has recently come out with roller saddle pieces for a LP tuneomatic, for Bigsby equipped guitars. (I can't remember where I read about it, though.) On strats, I prefer the vintage style stamped steel saddles over any others. The place that cuts the string is the breakover angle as the string comes up out of the bridge block on its way to the saddle. It's become routine to remove the saddles, blend the edges to a gradual radius using a dremel, etc., then putting back the standard saddles. No more string breakage, and good sustain (better than AmStd sintered stainless steel saddles, by the way). I realize I'm rambling, but I just wanted to share these few tips or options. Doc

10/20/1999 4:48 PM

Doc

After you cut the nut slots to the final depth for your preferred string height, you can lift the nut out and sand down the top surface to effectively remove the excess "wall" height across the nut. Use progressively finer grits to finish & polish the nut, then reinstall it permanently. Some folks add a trace of wax or vaseline+graphite powder paste to the string slot to break the "sticktion", which also helps reduce the sawing effect of wound strings.

Old Fender guitars had wide vee cut nut slots, so the string only rested on the bottom of the groove. It seems they used a universal nut file, not like the guaged widths sold today. You can fashion this wide groove with a normal triangular file, to separate the tight parallel walls away from the string, after you've cut the groove depths with guaged nut slot files. Roll the top edge over to chamfer the vee out onto the top surface, then finish all edges smooth.

I know GraphTech saddles do the job at the bridge, but for some reason I don't care for black bits on my nickel bridge. Someone has recently come out with roller saddle pieces for a LP tuneomatic, for Bigsby equipped guitars. (I can't remember where I read about it, though.) On strats, I prefer the vintage style stamped steel saddles over any others. The place that cuts the string is the breakover angle as the string comes up out of the bridge block on its way to the saddle. It's become routine to remove the saddles, blend the edges to a gradual radius using a dremel, etc., then putting back the standard saddles. No more string breakage, and good sustain (better than AmStd sintered stainless steel saddles, by the way).

I realize I'm rambling, but I just wanted to share these few tips or options.

Doc

10/20/1999 8:08 PM
moocow	Rollers, rollers, rollers ! Gretch uses a roller Tune-O-Matic style bridge on some of their Bigsby-equipped reissues. I've used the Schaller roller bridge and it works very well with a Bigsby. It has the same post spacing as the Gibson TOM, but the guitar will need to be drilled for the large Schaller bushings. Also, the Schaller bridge radius is too large to match the 7 1/4" radius of a vintage Fender fingerboard. The high and low E strings will be kind of far from the fingerboard, which will bother some people. Still, I've used it on a reissue Telecaster and Jazzmaster, and both guitars play well and stay in tune. Some people say that heavier strings help keep a Bigsby in tune. I've always used 11's, so I don't know what happens with smaller strings. About five years ago, the Fender Custom shop built the fanciest Telecaster w/Bigsby I've ever seen. The "Bigsby" tailpiece was actually a design by Trevor Wilkinson. Instead of a single tension bar, it had six rollers, one for each string. The bridge was a roller version of a Wilkinson Telecaster bridge and the nut was a single roller Wilkinson. It also had Gotoh vintage style locking tuners, and the headstock was kicked back like a Gibson. This was done to eliminate friction caused by the string tree. An inquiry was made as to the availability of this Bigsby variant, but Trevor said that Fender only made about 12-16 of these guitars and they didn't think there would be enough demand for such a bridge/tailpiece to put them into production.

10/20/1999 8:08 PM

moocow

Rollers, rollers, rollers !

Gretch uses a roller Tune-O-Matic style bridge on some of their Bigsby-equipped reissues.

I've used the Schaller roller bridge and it works very well with a Bigsby. It has the same post spacing as the Gibson TOM, but the guitar will need to be drilled for the large Schaller bushings. Also, the Schaller bridge radius is too large to match the 7 1/4" radius of a vintage Fender fingerboard. The high and low E strings will be kind of far from the fingerboard, which will bother some people. Still, I've used it on a reissue Telecaster and Jazzmaster, and both guitars play well and stay in tune.

Some people say that heavier strings help keep a Bigsby in tune. I've always used 11's, so I don't know what happens with smaller strings.

About five years ago, the Fender Custom shop built the fanciest Telecaster w/Bigsby I've ever seen. The "Bigsby" tailpiece was actually a design by Trevor Wilkinson. Instead of a single tension bar, it had six rollers, one for each string. The bridge was a roller version of a Wilkinson Telecaster bridge and the nut was a single roller Wilkinson. It also had Gotoh vintage style locking tuners, and the headstock was kicked back like a Gibson. This was done to eliminate friction caused by the string tree.

An inquiry was made as to the availability of this Bigsby variant, but Trevor said that Fender only made about 12-16 of these guitars and they didn't think there would be enough demand for such a bridge/tailpiece to put them into production.

10/21/1999 10:31 PM
Farrow	I play a '70s Gretsch Roc Jet and a (beautiful) factory-second '90s Korean Epiphone Casino, both with B11 Bigsbys. The B11 is the one with the "frame" cutout (the place usualy painted black with "Bigsby" on it. It's a double-roller (like the "horeshoe" units.) I replaced the nuts on both guitars with Corian -- actually cut from a free sample I got from a cabinet-making place. They have like a million colors and will give you a 1/2" x 2 "x 2" piece for free. Corian is VERY tough and doesn't get "sawed" by wound strings too much. It's also harder than the Graph-Tech nuts, which I like. Nice bright sound. The bridge on the Gretsch originally was the 6-roller Gretsch Space Command unit, but the saddles rattled so much I put the Bigsby bridge on. Interesting note: the underside of the Bigsby bridge is machined to a point, sort of. I guess this is so it will rock on the thumbwheels. The guitar stayed in tune better when I ground it flat. Go figure. The Casino has Graph-Tech saddles on the import Gotoh tunamatic. No tuning problems ever. BTW I use .013" - .056" Farrow http://surf.to/pharaohamps

10/21/1999 10:31 PM

Farrow

I play a '70s Gretsch Roc Jet and a (beautiful) factory-second '90s Korean Epiphone Casino, both with B11 Bigsbys. The B11 is the one with the "frame" cutout (the place usualy painted black with "Bigsby" on it. It's a double-roller (like the "horeshoe" units.)

I replaced the nuts on both guitars with Corian -- actually cut from a free sample I got from a cabinet-making place. They have like a million colors and will give you a 1/2" x 2 "x 2" piece for free. Corian is VERY tough and doesn't get "sawed" by wound strings too much. It's also harder than the Graph-Tech nuts, which I like. Nice bright sound. The bridge on the Gretsch originally was the 6-roller Gretsch Space Command unit, but the saddles rattled so much I put the Bigsby bridge on. Interesting note: the underside of the Bigsby bridge is machined to a point, sort of. I guess this is so it will rock on the thumbwheels. The guitar stayed in tune better when I ground it flat. Go figure.

The Casino has Graph-Tech saddles on the import Gotoh tunamatic. No tuning problems ever.

BTW I use .013" - .056"

Farrow
http://surf.to/pharaohamps

10/23/1999 8:25 PM
Steve A.	Re: Graphtec saddles and a properly cut nut,...(m) -Y: In my experience, Sperzels and other locking tuners have been no better than Schallers and Grovers about keeping in tune. If you crazy with dive bombs on a strat without a locking nut, the Sperzels will definitely make a difference. But for regular playing, the notched Fender style pegs seem to stay in tune very well. I also have another strat with a Wilkenson tremelo bridge and unmarked locking tuners- although the strings remains firmly attached to the pegs, some of the pegs will rotate if you yank up on the strings... Steve Ahola P.S. I had a guitar that kept going out of tune... what was unusual was that the pitch would get higher. Whoa! Turns out that the strings were binding on the nut which I had replaced with one made out of graphite. (This guitar has a HipShot Trilogy bridge which can raise and lower each string to one of 3 pitches that you set yourself with an allen wrench. It was actually harder to tune that bridge than to install it: the neck flexs a bit as the tension changes when you raise and lower different strings. So you really can't get that many different tunings from it that are automatically in tune- the "three" implied by the Trilogy name is a reasonable estimate of its capabilities. I was hoping to get maybe a dozen different tunings from it- sort of like a pedal steel guitar- but a pedal steel guitar neck does not flex like a regular guitar neck.)

10/23/1999 8:25 PM

Steve A.

Re: Graphtec saddles and a properly cut nut,...(m)

-Y:

In my experience, Sperzels and other locking tuners have been no better than Schallers and Grovers about keeping in tune.

If you crazy with dive bombs on a strat without a locking nut, the Sperzels will definitely make a difference. But for regular playing, the notched Fender style pegs seem to stay in tune very well. I also have another strat with a Wilkenson tremelo bridge and unmarked locking tuners- although the strings remains firmly attached to the pegs, some of the pegs will rotate if you yank up on the strings...

Steve Ahola

P.S. I had a guitar that kept going out of tune... what was unusual was that the pitch would get *higher*. Whoa! Turns out that the strings were binding on the nut which I had replaced with one made out of graphite. (This guitar has a HipShot Trilogy bridge which can raise and lower each string to one of 3 pitches that you set yourself with an allen wrench. It was actually harder to tune that bridge than to install it: the neck flexs a bit as the tension changes when you raise and lower different strings. So you really can't get that many different tunings from it that are automatically in tune- the "three" implied by the Trilogy name is a reasonable estimate of its capabilities. I was hoping to get maybe a dozen different tunings from it- sort of like a pedal steel guitar- but a pedal steel guitar neck does not flex like a regular guitar neck.)

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