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Vintage threads from the first ten years

SF bay area amp tech

1/29/2000 6:30 AM
bernard d.	SF bay area amp tech i have a problem with a point to point modded bassman reissue that i cannot fix. Can you folks give me some names and numbers of some top notch amp techs here in N. California? thanks in advance, bernard

1/29/2000 9:27 AM
John Stokes	Where in NorCal? In the Bay Area, Ron Ott in Pleasanton is excellent. Stay away from the modders.

2/1/2000 1:26 AM
D.Rice	" STAY AWAY FROM THE MODDERS"...Yeah, any of us who consent to the sacreligious practice of modding -anything, I guess- should never be trusted under any circumstances. Sheesh... I guess you think that since I'll do a modification (within reason) at a customer's request, if a '59 Bassman comes across my bench needing only a new pilot lamp, I'll gleefully "hack" the "warmth" and "punchiness" right outta the poor, holy thing (or maybe you're one of those canine-eared, collector psychos who would insist on finding a N.O.S. lamp because you can " hear the difference, man"). I mean, I dig old, cool stuff as much as the next guy, and agree that, yeah, it should, in most cases, be preserved, but when all is said and done, IT'S JUST STUFF, MAN!! Don't chase customers away from competent, well-adjusted repairpersons just because your mom threw away your priceless Mouseketeer stuff and you vowed that nothing like that would ever happen again, so help you God, and became a twitchy, obsessive/compulsive pot huffin' hippy dork. Dog, that felt good- Dave

2/1/2000 1:26 AM

D.Rice

" STAY AWAY FROM THE MODDERS"...Yeah, any of us who consent to the sacreligious practice of modding -anything, I guess- should never be trusted under any circumstances. Sheesh... I guess you think that since I'll do a modification (within reason) at a customer's request, if a '59 Bassman comes across my bench needing only a new pilot lamp, I'll gleefully "hack" the "warmth" and "punchiness" right outta the poor, holy thing (or maybe you're one of those canine-eared, collector psychos who would insist on finding a N.O.S. lamp because you can " hear the difference, man"). I mean, I dig old, cool stuff as much as the next guy, and agree that, yeah, it should, in most cases, be preserved, but when all is said and done, IT'S JUST STUFF, MAN!! Don't chase customers away from competent, well-adjusted repairpersons just because your mom threw away your priceless Mouseketeer stuff and you vowed that nothing like that would ever happen again, so help you God, and became a twitchy, obsessive/compulsive pot huffin' hippy dork.
Dog, that felt good-
Dave

2/1/2000 3:10 AM
John Stokes	Look Dave, if you want to get nasty with the name calling and personalize this, so be it. Why do you hacks take this to the extreme anyway, don't be silly. You can easily obtain replacement light bulbs and sockets for old Fenders, so your example is stupid. Anyone who would perform hack-butcher mods should be avoided. There is a difference between repairing and hacking. I would hope you knew that, maybe not. In repairing, you replace failed parts with like parts, and they don't necessarily have to be NOS. Also, not all mods are hacks, like the BF mod for example. I guess In retrospect, I guess I should have said to stay away from the hack-butchers. Now, which category are you in?

2/1/2000 3:10 AM

John Stokes

Look Dave, if you want to get nasty with the name calling and personalize this, so be it. Why do you hacks take this to the extreme anyway, don't be silly. You can easily obtain replacement light bulbs and sockets for old Fenders, so your example is stupid. Anyone who would perform hack-butcher mods should be avoided. There is a difference between repairing and hacking. I would hope you knew that, maybe not. In repairing, you replace failed parts with like parts, and they don't necessarily have to be NOS. Also, not all mods are hacks, like the BF mod for example. I guess In retrospect, I guess I should have said to stay away from the hack-butchers. Now, which category are you in?

2/1/2000 4:56 AM
Steve A.	John: Now, which category are you in? Is it always an either/or proposition? Seems to me that someone could be qualified to handle both of those categories, although they are quite different and distinct. Tracking down a specific problem and restoring an amp to its original design is one specific talent known as "troubleshooting and repair". Redesigning a particular amp to overcome certain problems inherent with the original design is a completely different skill. As an HVAC service tech and service manager I am called upon to wear both of those hats practically every day. Troubleshooting is generally a "piece of cake" to me, and I get more personal enjoyment working with the factory reps in coming up with solutions for the design problems. Replacing the part that failed is one thing, but if it is prone to premature failure, you need to address the cause of that as well. Of course tube amps are a whole other ballgame than HVAC equipment (which, like small children, is best not heard at all!) It seems like a well-rounded top-notch amp tech could do practically anything to an amp, and have it sound great and look professional when he was done. If his personal ethics prevented him from actually performing those mods on a vintage piece of equipment in good condition, so much the better! A customer comes in and wants his Brand X amp to accomplish A, B and C; this well-rounded top-notch amp tech should have a good idea whether it is actually feasible, and if so, what modifications would be necessary. In many cases the customer has unreasonable expectations from his amp and is best off selling it and buying something that is more suitable for his needs. But sometimes he likes the amp exactly as it is, but his bandmates keep telling him to turn down and it doesn't sound as good at lower volumes. Adding a master volume may or may not be an acceptable solution depending on the specific amp in question. If the amp is a vintage model that looks like it had been dragged behind a pickup truck on a dirt road, he might even proceed to make some mods that would be considered to be "hack-butchery" if it had been in good condition. I don't see how the knowledge of what could be done to any amp, vintage or not, would in any way lessen the abilities or reputation of an expert amp tech. Knowledge is power, and the more we know the better. And having the ethics to draw the line at devaluing a vintage piece of equipment is definitely a plus. But do we need to resort to name-calling if we disagree at what point that line should be drawn? (Used to be that SF amps were "fair game" for modders, but now that it is well-known that they sound pretty damn good when restored to BF specs, they have been added to the endangered list of vintage amps...) Steve Ahola P.S. Speaking of "hack-butchery" I was just looking at a 1992 picture of Mick Taylor and his presumably vintage LP with the added Bigsby tremelo. If anybody here asked about doing that to an old LP (or to any LP for that matter!) most people would jump all over him. But I have to admit that Mick sure gets great sounds out of that guitar... "Hack butchery" or magic? Let the listener be the judge of that!

2/1/2000 4:56 AM

Steve A.

John:

Now, which category are you in?

    Is it always an either/or proposition? Seems to me that someone could be qualified to handle both of those categories, although they are quite different and distinct.

    Tracking down a specific problem and restoring an amp to its original design is one specific talent known as "troubleshooting and repair". Redesigning a particular amp to overcome certain problems inherent with the original design is a completely different skill.

    As an HVAC service tech and service manager I am called upon to wear both of those hats practically every day. Troubleshooting is generally a "piece of cake" to me, and I get more personal enjoyment working with the factory reps in coming up with solutions for the design problems. Replacing the part that failed is one thing, but if it is prone to premature failure, you need to address the cause of that as well.

    Of course tube amps are a whole other ballgame than HVAC equipment (which, like small children, is best not heard at all!)

    It seems like a well-rounded top-notch amp tech *could* do practically anything to an amp, and have it sound great and look professional when he was done. If his personal ethics prevented him from actually performing those mods on a vintage piece of equipment in good condition, so much the better!

    A customer comes in and wants his Brand X amp to accomplish A, B and C; this well-rounded top-notch amp tech should have a good idea whether it is actually feasible, and if so, what modifications would be necessary. In many cases the customer has unreasonable expectations from his amp and is best off selling it and buying something that is more suitable for his needs. But sometimes he likes the amp exactly as it is, but his bandmates keep telling him to turn down and it doesn't sound as good at lower volumes. Adding a master volume may or may not be an acceptable solution depending on the specific amp in question.

    If the amp is a vintage model that looks like it had been dragged behind a pickup truck on a dirt road, he might even proceed to make some mods that would be considered to be "hack-butchery" if it had been in good condition.

    I don't see how the knowledge of what *could* be done to any amp, vintage or not, would in any way lessen the abilities or reputation of an expert amp tech. Knowledge is power, and the more we know the better. And having the ethics to draw the line at devaluing a vintage piece of equipment is definitely a plus. But do we need to resort to name-calling if we disagree at what point that line should be drawn? (Used to be that SF amps were "fair game" for modders, but now that it is well-known that they sound pretty damn good when restored to BF specs, they have been added to the endangered list of vintage amps...)

Steve Ahola

P.S. Speaking of "hack-butchery" I was just looking at a 1992 picture of Mick Taylor and his presumably vintage LP with the added Bigsby tremelo. If anybody here asked about doing that to an old LP (or to any LP for that matter!) most people would jump all over him. But I have to admit that Mick sure gets great sounds out of that guitar... "Hack butchery" or magic? Let the listener be the judge of that!

2/1/2000 7:29 PM
D.Rice	Sorry to get nasty, John, I caught that post at the end of a very trying work day and just couldn't resist...however, I do think it's important to make the distinction between "modders" & "hack butchers", as you so aptly put it. By the way, the pilot light example was MEANT to be stupid. Anyway, sorry about the name-calling, nothing personal. -DAVE p.s. I know this subject is about as played-out as the macaroni/cheese vs. cheese/macaroni controversy, but I'm relatively new to this site & just had to add my two cents.

2/1/2000 7:29 PM

D.Rice

Sorry to get nasty, John, I caught that post at the end of a very trying work day and just couldn't resist...however, I do think it's important to make the distinction between "modders" & "hack butchers", as you so aptly put it. By the way, the pilot light example was MEANT to be stupid. Anyway, sorry about the name-calling, nothing personal.
-DAVE
p.s. I know this subject is about as played-out as the macaroni/cheese vs. cheese/macaroni controversy, but I'm relatively new to this site & just had to add my two cents.

2/2/2000 4:40 AM
Fred G.	I had originally decided to avoid this tired subject, but ... here goes : Most of us who have been coming here to this BB for any length of time know that this is a place for the exchange of do-it-yourself knowledge. Information is given freely, willingly, and without pre-judgement or name-calling. Everyone who asks for help with ANY type of mod can get it here, freely, and in good will. There has not, in the past, been a spirit of criticism against any poster for any mod he ( or she) may inquire about, regardless of how extensive the mod or to what make or model of amplifier was being considered for the mod. If a mod is ill-considered, the inquiree has usually been gently reminded that it may be permanent, and de-valuating to the amp in question; but, if they wished to continue, then the help and information was provided willingly. Some of the newer visitors here may have a hard time accepting this. I suspect the vast majority of us who have been hanging out here for a long time would somehow manage to fall into somone's narrow self-definition of "hack-butchers" - so be it. I'm tired of hearing it. I have acquired SO MUCH valuable information here - I have been freed from spending thousands of dollars on amps that I ended up not liking, and I now have the knowledge to tailor any amp to suit my needs ( or build my own). That is EMPOWERMENT, not "hack-butchery". I think I'm not alone in this sentiment. Name-callers, please leave here and find another doorway to darken. If you don't like what someone is asking, then just butt out and mind your own business. But please desist from ruining the spirit of cooperation and free sharing of knowledge that has existed here. Fred G.

2/2/2000 4:40 AM

Fred G.

I had originally decided to avoid this tired subject, but ... here goes :

Most of us who have been coming here to this BB for any length of time know that this is a place for the exchange of do-it-yourself knowledge. Information is given freely, willingly, and without pre-judgement or name-calling.

Everyone who asks for help with ANY type of mod can get it here, freely, and in good will. There has not, in the past, been a spirit of criticism against any poster for any mod he ( or she) may inquire about, regardless of how extensive the mod or to what make or model of amplifier was being considered for the mod. If a mod is ill-considered, the inquiree has usually been gently reminded that it may be permanent, and de-valuating to the amp in question; but, if they wished to continue, then the help and information was provided willingly. Some of the newer visitors here may have a hard time accepting this.
I suspect the vast majority of us who have been hanging out here for a long time would somehow manage to fall into somone's narrow self-definition of "hack-butchers" - so be it.
I'm tired of hearing it. I have acquired SO MUCH valuable information here - I have been freed from spending thousands of dollars on amps that I ended up not liking, and I now have the knowledge to tailor any amp to suit my needs ( or build my own). That is EMPOWERMENT, not "hack-butchery".
I think I'm not alone in this sentiment. Name-callers, please leave here and find another doorway to darken. If you don't like what someone is asking, then just butt out and mind your own business. But please desist from ruining the spirit of cooperation and free sharing of knowledge that has existed here.

Fred G.

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